Poster: A snowHead
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Was she hurt? make poor equipment choices? did she choke? I dont get it... Has she become the Anna Kournikova of Skiing? good looks, lots of self belief, with a marketing machine and a team of flunkies telling her how good she is while she consistently underperforms.
Last season a small team, good solid results and steady improvement. this year she gets a dozen coaches, advisors etc and doesnt do anything...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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skimottaret, Ouch.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, i dont want to come across bitchy as i think she has some talent and desire and could really do well. Not knocking her as to just make the WC circuit is a huge achievement. just wondering if she heaped too much pressure on herself or something...
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i thought ross said she'd been injured?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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skimottaret wrote: |
Has she become the Anna Kournikova of Skiing? |
In a bad way?
Any pictures of her in a tennis dress?
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beanie1, it was some foot surgery in the off season as supposedly she was fully fit, but who knows...
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skimottaret, whenever I saw footage of her it always seemed to me that her skis were really slow - don't know whether it was down to her gliding ability or wax/ equipment etc.
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I was also disappointed this year, as last season following her foot surgery she seemed to be going from strength to strength, but doesn't seem to have picked up that form again this year, when I was hoping she would building up to some regular top fifteens and top tens. It's such a shame as it must be so hard for people trying to reach the top level to tick every single one of the boxes at the right time consistently. Now she has support but it looks like something else was missing this season.
I didn't think she had more surgery last summer? I know she had surgery summer 06 to correct a problem, but that was much talked about in the 06/07 season as one of the reasons she was making such great progress. Has she had more in summer 07??
Although as per skimottaret, just making the WC circuit is a huge acheivementin itself, and I will always support GB skiers who get there against the odds, but it's also frustrating to see the 'so near but so far' side of it week in week out.
It's also been a shame (from a purely selfish TV viewing point of view) that this has also coincided with Finlay Mickel's injury problems, as it's made for a quiet season for viewing GB skiers in Alpine disciplines.
Hope Finlay makes a swift recovery and Chemmy irons out any issues and rediscovers her form of 06/07 to build on for next season.
D
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steve, yeah i thought the same, almost looked like she was on an easy training run and not hitting it hard. thats why i was wondering if her equipment doesnt suit but youd think they would have sorted that early season.
Deliaskis, sorry didnt mean to imply more surgery..
The last CH4 show i saw she got about 10 seconds of coverage and no one even interviewed her.. most strange. I wish her well but i cant help but wonder if after meeting sir clive and getting a nutritionist, sports phycologist, performance movement coach, sensory motors skills coach, wellness person, a manager and PA she may have her eye off the ball.
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Strange because she went into the season uninjured and with a full spring/summer/autumn of preparation behind her (the season before, when she got better results, she'd just come back from foot surgery and a short pre-season). I suspect the change of equipment hasn't worked out and that there was too much expectation (many predicting podiums). Too my eye she looks bulkier and a bit less agile than before, maybe that's it.
By the way, this is her off-season venture... www.justgiving.com/chemmyalcott
Perhaps the question should be "What's the deal with British Alpine Ski Team's results?"... Alain Baxter has all but disappeared from world cups, not making it into the second run at all (mind you, can't be easy with start numbers in the 70s!). He's doing OK at Europa Cup & FIS level but up against guys 2/3 of his age. Is he just hanging on for a final Olympics?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Bode Swiller, Alain as a 35 year slalom expert cant hope for much at WC level... your probably right just hanging on for his swansong and some closure.
she may have overtrained and your right she definately looks less agile when skiing. What was the big equipment change if any?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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She is on the tigershark rights? Dont mean to be a fly in the ointment here but is it just that she is not good enough and like all English athletes is overhyped? The standard is so high and coming from a country with no regular skiing is she at a huge disadvantage? The amount of time she would have spent as a teenager skiing compared to the Austrians and Germans and the level of training would just not come up to scratch!
She has achived alot and has been amazing at times but her chances have to be seen in relation to her real talent and support?
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skimottaret, She's gone from the full Fischer package to Volkl Tecnica. Big move changing skis and boots. Mind you Volkl are leading the ladies brand ranking so can't blame the tools really. She either is less agile or someone has tried to coach-out her natural wild style and make her smoooooth. I preferred the on-the-edge Chemmy.
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You know it makes sense.
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Maybe she's just past it? With young turks like Lara Gutt on the scene every days is a little bit older.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I too have been wondering whether her equipment has played a part, - admittedly from a vantage point of knowing naff all.
There was a feature on the ski technicians' role on the world cup circuit this season on either Ski Sunday or Ch4 and I was astonished to hear how much time difference a really superbly prepared set of skis could make as compared to adequately prepared skis. I can't imagine that the GB team will have the resources available to the Austrian or USA teams. I'm not saying this is the problem but it was certainly food for thought.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Her technician (Herbi Frankhauser) is probably supplied by the Volkl factory. I'd imagine she gets pretty much same treatment as the top girls.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Quote: |
She either is less agile or someone has tried to coach-out her natural wild style and make her smoooooth. I preferred the on-the-edge Chemmy.
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i think your on the mark there on all counts and i too preferred the on the edge style, seemed to get her better results...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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In the last week Chemmy has won the Austrian National Champs GS title AND the French National Champs GS title. Not all the stars were there but hey!
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Bode Swiller, And also 5th in both of the Super G race's.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Bode Swiller, her new era of coaching was designed to tease the raging bull from her and make her into a ballerina - her words not mine.
Equipment problems - possible but unlikely. I ski the Volkl Race Tigers and they are top skis and used by many on the racing circuit (tele and alpine). Equipment is not a good enough excuse - maybe she needs time to build under her new charges - she wasn't happy with a bundle of her results this year - but then compared to the rest of the British Alpine Team that failed to start most of the season she was doing the best.
Winning the Austiran Champs is good but how many other top national skiers were there?
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TelemarkKing wrote: |
but then compared to the rest of the British Alpine Team that failed to start most of the season she was doing the best. |
To be fair to the mens side the many DNS's etc were due to injuries and illness - not just that they couldn't be bothered to turn up! With so many of them starting to push each other for slots they just wouldn't get away with that.
Just seems not to have worked for Chemmy this year - a shame as all the hype before the season was that she as for once fully fit.... Not sure of the reasons why but I noticed towards the end of the season even the British commentators were running out of excuses etc and just saying she has to start delivering, which I think is the case. Hopefully better results next year, if not I think it will be too late with all the new youngsters from other nations coming up to try and push people out of the top 30.
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vivski wrote: |
TelemarkKing wrote: |
but then compared to the rest of the British Alpine Team that failed to start most of the season she was doing the best. |
To be fair to the mens side the many DNS's etc were due to injuries and illness - not just that they couldn't be bothered to turn up! With so many of them starting to push each other for slots they just wouldn't get away with that. |
I know that injuries occur but the entire men's squad pratically off the road is ridiculous - I don't see many of the the other teams having 90% of their athletes on the sick.
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skimottaret wrote: |
Has she become the Anna Kournikova of Skiing? good looks, lots of self belief, with a marketing machine |
Her latest publicity (the article in the Metro) unfortunately suggests just that.
http://www.metro.co.uk/sport/oddballs/article.html?in_article_id=136778&in_page_id=46
Is this the kind of marketing she's after? Maybe so as she's trying to raise her profile ahead of her charity Mt Kilimanjaro trek with Julia Mancuso in the summer.
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I take your point about the higher ranked athletes, but still considering the other teams there were no big blow outs that resulted in having to write off a majority of the season. What I am saying is where are we going wrong - are the expectations so high that when our nations athletes set foot on the snow they are recklessly pursuing their dream and thus on the edge of their game - resulting in injury; or are we not preparing our athletes properly and giving them the support they need. You only need to read about 18 year old Sega Fairweather's saga surrounding the British Champs which she flew across from the US to compete in only to be messed around when she arrived - and she was requested to come rather tha of her own accord. She injured herself in the Super G - a combination of a number of things but preparation was the key.
DNFs I can cope with, in the 2nd run, there is really little excuse for DNF in the 1st. I understand about the rankings as the same happens in telemark, but it is not an excuse. The British Alpine Teams spent most of the summer in Chile, then they went to Austria for to train before the World Cup. Each athlete pays an amount £5000 or £10000 depending on the tier of their involvment for their training and Snowsport GB through sponsors and Lottery funds do the rest. For that they get bed and board, all their training, travel etc for the entire season and then some. Not to whinge too much but I spent about £7500 to compete for GB in Telemark this season and the same last season, I didn't get all the support and advice that the British Alpine team received - admittedly Alpine has a larger follwing but I still finished in the top 30 in the world. I don't expect masses of support but if I was getting all that training I would expect to be in the top 10 if not 5 at the end of the season. At least this is possible given the correct training and advice for a Brit in Telemark.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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TelemarkKing, I also take your point, and your results in the telemark have been fantastic - I must admit to not knowing so much about it so don't know how the number of competitors etc compares to alpine, but regardless being in the top 30 in the world is a hell of an achievement. I can also appreciate it must be horrendously frustrating for you to do so well yet see most of the money go to alpine racers who don't seem to do as well.
The whole Sega Saga around the british champs was just ridiculous (have followed it on MSS), her crash in the GS looked horrible and hopefully she will recover quickly - this is a good example of SSGB being biased against athletes who are not based in the british system - which is silly as certainly results from sega and some others show that it is an extremely effective approach to go to race academies in the states etc. I have no doubt her results were affected badly by the whole farce and may have also contributed to the crash.
I also see your point about people being right on the edge trying to achieve - but it does happen to others, several athletes had crashes that ruled them out of lots of the season - Aksel springs to mind, and one of the canadians, and look at lanzingers horrific crash - admittedly at the end of the season but it could have happened earlier - and many blame a lot of injuries in teams such as Austria on how hard the athletes have to push, even in unfavourable conditions, just to keep their place. And the point is made by the slalom and GS skiers that DNFs happen in the first run because in this level of competition you can't hold back in run 1 or you don't make the top 30 and get into run 2 - especially if coming from a high start number.
Personally I think expectations are getting higher, among the athletes themselves as much as anything, and I don't think you can expect them to hold back - they go out and race to win, or do as well as they possibly can. To be honest I think this year was unlucky, pure and simple. The guys had great results in Chile etc then it just didn't work out later in the season. If this continues next year then, yes, maybe there is a fundamental problem, but with a small number of athletes compared to the alpine nations it is more likely that we notice the absence of one or two athletes through injury.
I guess from your posts that you think the money going on alpine is wasted and should be spent on telemark as better results are possible there? Unfortunately, as you say, alpine has a much bigger following and so many kids, even in Britain, now who want to compete - should they not be given the chance because we have never been very strong in alpine skiing? I think the results will come when the new boys coming up finally break into the World Cup - if people will give them the chance and not write them off because Finlay and Noel got injured.
But more money and publivity for telemark would certainly be great, and it is pretty scandalous that the great results you guys achieve are not publicised more on skiing on 4 etc - maybe the alpine guys are scared of losing their money?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Unfortunately and rather distastefully the whole thing boils down to money - without it the facilities are just not available. I don't wish to rob the Alpine set of their cash, far from it, but I would like to see a fair distribution. Snowsports GB is the governing body for ALL British Snowsports, it sems that the only ones they care about is Snowboarding and Alpine - it has very little to do with exposure when it comes to supporting fairly. Why should there be any difference when it comes to the website, or launches. Surely all the teams should be launched together. There was an event in London last year where C4 hothouse productions had followed the Alpine team through summer training and there was a big cocktail party in the Vue cinema in Leicester Square. The only teams represented were the Snowboarders and the Alpinists - there was not even a mention in the sidelines that GB have teams in Cross Country, Freestyle, Telemark, Speed Skiing...the list continues. There is this talk about branding and the only brands anyone talks about are the Alpine - even the snowboarders get very little and Zoe Gillings is doing amazingly well! How many people have heard of her I wonder? How many athletes in winter sports are household names I also wonder...I mean everyone knows the Redgraves, Chambers, Holmes etc of GB sporting fame, I know, I know about Chambers but notoreity or acheivement, it doesn't matter - people know who they are!
It irks me so because I don't really expect much, but all we hear about is Alpine team this, Alpine team that, is it any wonder that Alpine get the lions share of the funds allocated to Snowsports GB - no-one has heard of any of the other teams! I am not asking for my name to be written in lights but I would like, as I am sure many other athletes in British Snowsports would agree, some recognition for the hard work, time and financial commitment I put in trying to put GB on the Winter Sports map of acheivement.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Thu 10-04-08 16:31; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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Let's stage a naked protest in london wearing only ski boots andsnowheads stickers to cover our modesty!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Both alpine skiing and snowboarding are Olympic sports. If telemarking was in the Olympics I'm sure you'd see a lot more funding and support, especially with the results you have to date.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Sideshow_Bob, good point and as the newly appointed Telemark FIS committee member that is my next quest - OLYMPIC STATUS for TELEMARK!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Just out of interest, what are the rules for telemark skiing? Presumably you're not allowed any heel restraint, but is there anything style-wise that defines the difference between a telemark turn and an alpine turn? I've seen people carve parallel turns on tele skis without any knee-dropping and I'd have thought this would be faster for a racing turn than dropping the knee.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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there are penalties of 1 second for each time the alpine stance is observed by the gate judge. Thus each turn is executed in true telemark style, with a quick transition before the next. If the judge determines that the transition is not a fluid movement or there is not a full boot length between the front and back foot during the turn they will apply a penalty. In addition there are penalties for not clearing a set distance on the jump and not landing in the telemark stance.
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So you have to ski a prescribed style that is not limited solely by the equipment but by the subjective opinion of a human judge? Not doubting the skill you guys have, it just seems a bit too "artificial" for my liking; I don't see Bode Miller being docked seconds because the gate judges think he's sat back a bit too far or for riding up the netting on the Hannenkahm.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Exactly, but it is a different sport and there are plenty of Olympic sports that rely on human judgement too - synchronised swimming, diving, ice skating etc...The judges are not just any old mick, they are seasoned officials that have a good history in telemark. The strictest on the circuit are undoubtedly the Norwegians - but I do agree there is some subjectivity but the subjectivity it applied to everyone we just have to hope that the judges are judging equally.
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Well, I'd watch it if it was on TV. Would I get hooked? I don't know . But I'd like to have the chance to find out.
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maggi, Thanks for the vote. If only more would follow. It really is an exciting spectator sport. Although I may be the only one to think so. When I asked Eurosport if they might show some telemark they replied 'telemark is not a spectator sport'...what and World Championship Snooker is?
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Mod - can we move this to another thread - I am conscious that telemark has hi-jacked this one
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Martin Bell wrote: |
Getting away from the joys of tele-ing and back to Chemmy:
Despite being "bounced" into second place by Julia Mancuso in the hot tub event (fnarr fnarr), Chemmy actually won the GS by quite a margin |
Martin, this is one race, what happened in the rest? The post does ask what is the deal with her result(s) this year. I guess we are trying to ascertain why her performance was not consistent - A number of reasons have been mooted, but who knows. In my eyes she is trying hard, and tis difficult to judge one year to the next just based on placings but something seemed wrong this year, and Chemmy admits she wasn't happy with her results either. What is your opinion?
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads on Fri 11-04-08 19:38; edited 1 time in total
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